Its not about research or information, its about ego and emotion. The club was designed and built with certain characteristics. As long as the spin rate is acceptable, the new irons, because of their lower center of gravity, are going to produce more speed off the face (due to the lower loft and lower COG) and more distance. In the last six years, Tony Finau and Viktor Hovland both broke their maiden here, whilst after a period of personal tragedy, multiple winner, Branden Grace, bounced back to form. By Greyson P. I just purchase a great used 712 AP2 set. Everyone tries to boast yardage, not consistency and accuracy. By adding loft, those golfers achieve more ideal launch conditions, which means they carry shots farther and stop the ball faster on the green. Restore formatting, I have a 17-degree 4-wood, a 21-degree hybrid, a 26-degree hybrid, and a 29-degree iron as my longer (non-driver) clubs. Good point. An ideal Launch Angle and Spin Rate for a Ball Speed with a 6 iron of 115 MPH would be right about 15-16* and 6000 RPMs respectively. That is why getting the numbers is so important. With the high bounce level of the stock G30's, losing some of that bounce by bending it strong is no sweat, but plenty of clubs have so little bounce that bending them strong leaves virtually nothing left in the bounce department, but bounce really only helps if you strike the ball a little on the fat side. I have a 2 iron bent 2 strong to 16. The Ever Changing Bag! Lofts don't always come in 4-degree increments. I am 2 handicap, playing Scottish Links golf, smooth tempo, 80-90mph, pretty straight flight, shallow divot. Step 1 for those golfers is to increase ball speed. The one with a ballflight too high, is delivering the clubhead I am purchasing new irons and am seriously considering getting the lofts 2* weak to create a 48* PW and 4* loft spacing. Not sure about the AP2s. Clear editor. Golfers who know this information will have a much easier time controlling their ball flight, hitting the center of the clubface more consistently. I would never ever think of doing this on my own. Ping G30 irons w/Recoil 95 Check out the different lie angles of a standard 8 iron from these three companies: I know that the difference between these angles doesnt seem like much. We'll walk you through the process and offer some simple tips and trick. Yeah, you can bend them strong and not notice the difference in terms of look. Titleist U500 3 & 4 Oban Kiyoshi Purple Tour Reserve My irons are bent weak partly to get the right launch conditions but also to reduce my draw. TaylorMade M2 (2016) 9.5* (2* lower) HZRDUS T1100 75g 6.5 Undershooter If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Absolutely GREAT analogy RoverRick. For most players the answer is - MORE than we normally can bend static lof, Lower launch, lower flight (generally) but you lose some bounce and add offset, Titleist TSi4 8.25* / Fujikura Ventus Black TR 7-X I'm fascinated by your basis for changing the lofts? For this discussion, lets define proficiency as the level where you can reasonably expect to move the ball around the course efficiently and consistently enough to shoot 90 or better, though your own goals might be somewhere lower. Thankfully gone are the days of everyone demanding s300 S or X when they dont have the swing speed to support them. It is hard for some golfers to understand how irons with more loft can help them hit the ball farther, and this is understandable. I know some pros naturally hit it higher, and some lower. It, In any case one can't really compare clubs anymore with respect to asking what someone hit. Worked very well IMO in terms of reducing spin You will need to check your distances with these gapped lofts. TaylorMade Rsi TP 3-PW (1.5* strong) NS-Pro MOdus 3 tour130 X Ping G30 irons w/Recoil 95 Feel free to browse around and see if anything catches your eye! Hi everyone, sorry for the slow reply! You don't say what club it is, but Rev said it sounds like a long iron and I agree. The 2 that were out the most went from 'avoided' clubs to 'favourites'! In fact, a sound, fundamental hold on the club is the first step in setting up for a technically sound golf swing. I just purchased a new set of 716MB irons. Its like that distance is just not filled. Your email address will not be published. More than likely you will hit the ball a bit farther as well, potentially close to 1/2 a club. Or, is the bounce all the same? Im 62 and most GI clubs are too long even for me in their stock iteration with this progressive shaft lengths concept. Mizuno JPX 921 Hot Metal. Using a club bending machine to change the angle on a golf club is among the fastest ways to improve a players ball flight. Ping G425 5 wood & hybrid Hope this Helps! PING Forged wedges I'm guessing it will dig more but how much more? Started Thursday at 03:24 PM. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. weight removed), Ball:1. TM TP UDi #1 w/ Diamana Check out our video: how-to bend your clubs on a Mitchell Golf Angle Machine:Get Bending! (I ran into this today.) But if your best place for improvement is in your approach shots or play with the long clubs, you simply must work on your fundamentals of the golf swing. A wind-affected island track that offers rewards for aggression. Upload or insert images from URL. Bending strong 2* decreases bounce by 2* and increases offset by about .75mm. GolfWRX_Official For you lower swing speed players, go to blades with weaker lofts or better yet go to an old vintage blades with the pitching wedge 52 degrees, and you can hit the ball farther hehe. You might as well get a distance gap before bending. Working through the grades, hisdebut, five-shot victory on the KFT,was backed up with a pair of top-10s and two-top-20s, easily enough to nab his PGA Tour card for 2022/23. -How much do you vary on club delivery for Angle or attack and Dynamic loft? Golfers can talk about shafts until they are blue in the face, and different shafts will make a difference in control, feel and sometimes launch and spin. Why would you weaken the lofts of every club and increase the bounce angle by a proportionate amount if you could just get rid of the 3 iron and add a gap wedge? Lets assume that the launch angle with a modern-lofted set of irons is ideal. Privacy Policy And the opposite is true as the speed drops. Simply put, bending the iron 6.5 degrees strong wasn't an option. Is that ok? What amazes me the most is how many golfers will continually spend thousands of dollars on golf equipment but never take the initiative to change those fundamental things that will help them really improve their skills and abilities. The new grooves should also be mentioned as allowing the ball to slide up the face a little more compared to the older grooves. Putter: Snake Eyes Viper Tour Sv1, 34" -or- Cleveland Huntington Beach #1, 34.5" -or- Golden Ram TW Custom, 34" -or- Rife Bimini, 34" - Chick Evans, Irons: Mizuno T-Zoid True 5, 7 and 9-irons, Wedge: Mizuno S18 54* and Top Flite chipper, I will add a little to what was posted above. Club design of a particular club can be a factor also. On 7/12/2018 at 3:15 PM, PoeKingShankspeare said: Please put and questions or comments here, Please put any questions or comments here, Please put any questions of comments here, w/ SuperStroke 2.MidSlim (50 gr. The fitter can then analyze a golfers swing pattern and adjust the lie angle accordingly. Does that create the maximum distance for that ball speed? This is especially true of clubs made with long hosels. I've had plenty of clubs bent a degree or two and never had an issue with how the clubs performed, even a wedge. Still have questions? Hes happy to answer any of your questions! The bounce on the 3-iron is already 0 degrees, so will bending the club for a stronger loft make the bounce go negative? Would they still be ideal? Driver: G425 LST 9on Fujikura VENTUSBlue 5S, Fairway: G425LST 3w on Fujikura VENTUSBlue 6S, G425MAX 9won Graphite Design Tour ADDI7S, Utility: KING Forged Utility Black 4 on UST RECOIL SMACWRAP, Irons: KING Forged TEC Black5-Gon Mitsubishi MMT, Wedges:ES2154& Hi Toe Raw58on KBS Hi Rev 2.0, Putter: Triple Track Double Wide White Hot, Balls: Pro V1TP5xChrome Soft Triple Track x LS. I'm not so much of a digger with long irons, and I thought about getting my rogue 5i bent a degree stronger and not carry a 4. I always found it a bit strange that I could be 20-40 yards ahead of some friends yet hit the same distance with mid to short irons. So glad this was posted. Will keep that in mind from now on, It is hard for some golfers to understand how irons with more loft can help them hit the ball farther,. Editors note: This article is in collaboration with Shot Scope. Will I be digging too much? Like you said, it will change the bounce but other than that, it wont change much and shouldnt effect the playability of the club unless you are really steep and need the bounce. PXG 0311P Gen 3 - 5to PW - Nippon 125 X When you get 2* gaps on the long end there is almost no difference between clubs. Dont worry and overthink this like most doo. I teach golf on the Eastern side of Michigan where I am the Director of Instruction for three golf courses. I have been reading that the more offset you add it will end up more of a hook shot. I am a club fitter also and see this every day. It would decrease the bounce on each club, not a good idea, as well as it would cause the ball to go farther. :-). Most people won't hit a 2 iron off the fairway though, so they probably won't take a divot at all As far as bounce goes, do you really think a club going 100 mph is going to be affected by 2 less of bounce? Thats why I custom order iron sets with lofts that are 1-to-2 degrees weaker than standard about 40 percent of the time. The market is fascinating this week, with world number 376 Andrew Novak leading the field. Just about every club that leaves the factory won't be 100% spot on for loft, manufacturing tolerances are going to throw that out. 50*, 54* bent to 55* and 60*, Putter- Taylormade Spider Tour w/ flow neck of distance, and more playable iron trajectories. High bounce irons absorb a change like this more easily. Everyone's comments are super helpful! 2023 Arnold Palmer Invitational - Discussion and Links to Photos, 2023 The Honda Classic - Discussion and Links to photos, 2023 Genesis Invitational - Discussion and Links to photos, 2023 Waste Management Phoenix Open - Discussion and Links to Photos, 2023 AT&T Pebble Beach Pro-Am - Discussion and Links to all photos, Fitness, maximum efficiency for the time spent. Tour Preferred X or TP5x ball. Ping G400 Max driver w/Aldila Rogue 125 Silver Started Thursday at 03:24 PM, Please put and questions or comments here, Please put any questions or comments here, Please put any questions of comments here. I suspect Ill be waiting a very long time, Amen, finally some one with great insight. The bend overlap in angle iron will be bigger so you need to allow for a 1/2 inch. It would increase if you added loft. The 4 iron will have a negative bounce if you bend them 2 degrees. Espana. Sorry to be a jerk but this topic comes up quite regularly so there are dozens of threads in the archives discussing this same topic. On a driver? Ordering & Information -How much do you vary on club delivery for Angle or attack and Dynamic loft? Will bending irons 2 degrees strong promote more of a draw ball flight? That said, people will usually launch clubs higher with a longer shaft length as well, (mechanical advantage/physics) so again, it kind of goes hand in hand with the stronger lofts. But regardless of the type of change you are trying to make, you also have to be willing to commit to it and suffer the learning period oftentimes you have to get worse (for a while) to get better (permanently). Calla SuperHot (Orange preferred) ||Bag: Sun Mountain Three 5 stand bag. You must log in or register to reply here. I've had plenty of clubs bent a degree or two and never had an issue with how the clubs performed, even a wedge. My miss is hitting it fat, so I was especially concerned with how bending them strong would affect bounce. 2023 Arnold Palmer Invitational - Discussion and Links to Photos, 2023 The Honda Classic - Discussion and Links to photos, 2023 Genesis Invitational - Discussion and Links to photos, 2023 Waste Management Phoenix Open - Discussion and Links to Photos, 2023 AT&T Pebble Beach Pro-Am - Discussion and Links to all photos, Fitness, maximum efficiency for the time spent. 00bolt, May 18, 2017 in WRX Club Techs. Nick so, how much difference can CoG location make to the optimum loft? If you are taking big divots with a 2 iron you have some serious problems with your swing. 3" = 4.6* and 6" = 9.2* change in loft. Since loft and bounce is connected, and cant be split no matter what we do. The golfwrx wannabe touring pros will argue otherwise.. After reading the headline I was expecting a slightly different subject discussed but this topic is something Ive been wondering about myself. The average golfer leaves 65 percent of all approach shots short of the green. Bending the hosel toward or away from the face plane, opens or closes the clubs face angle. You can also bend the angles to a consistent specification precisely fit for any golfer. I dont want the extra length added to the shaft plus the x7 2i shaft I have for it is the last x7 shaft i have. Craig, If you want to simply hit the ball further, find an iron that launches really high and spins really low, you will knuckle ball the shot a long ways, but odds are you will not be able to control yardages or stop the ball under most conditions. Learn how your comment data is processed. May 20, 2016 at 10:43 AM most amateurs like to hit the long ball not the low score. The only way you would see a difference is if you put them side by side with another set of Ap2's that are not bent. In the five starts mentioned above, the St. Simons resident has some impressive first round finishes. I should have made the same swing with a 9 iron, to compensate for the lie, but did not. Great article. "so, any advice, I keep air mailing greens with my PW from 140, this is really hurting my score. If a golfer was a digger, will he/she still get somewhat better turf interaction with the GI irons vs. with a players irons? I know its different for each golfer depending on their individual characteristics but do you have rough numbers (for iron set) to be looking for in terms of launch angle, spin rate etc. Another point regarding GI/SGI clubs that I would love to see a fitter touch on is shaft length. 16,822. Thanks for your advice, its been helpful. If you change your AOA and go 2* steeper, both delivered loft and bounce is reduced by 2* Im also adding a 5 wood to the bag and changing to a 54/60 wedge set-up. Newer irons, however, are designed with a loft angle that is between 18 and 22 degrees. And you are right about the irons listed, X Hot is a shockingly low launching iron and the G25 would be the exact opposite, with Rocketbladez mixed in the middle. Yes, it is possible to bend the irons 1-2 degrees stronger, but by doing so you would be reducing the effective bounce on the clubs. The club only has .5 degrees of bounce as it is. The main reason it is done on GolfWRX is so people can brag how far they hit their irons, generally with a passive brag. The bounce on irons is pretty much a non starter in my opinion. I take healthy beaver pelts with short irons, but the 2 iron is just a nip of grass. Strengthening the loft should decrease the effective offset shouldn't it? would 2 degrees be too much and change the club's characteristics too much? You may have heard golfers talk about how they need to use a flatter club or that they need to change their lie angle. You cannot paste images directly. From my research into various golfer communities, it is highly likely that if you are reading this blog post you probably are playing to somewhere between a 5 and 16 handicap. If the added ball speed of modern irons is not enough to achieve an ideal landing angle, I have to add loft. After this long introduction, Nick keep preaching this gospel. A 1 degree lie angle change, either flat or more upright, can cause a 4-yard difference either left or right of a straight target. It is a taylormade udi 2i that I want to bend from 18* to 16*. They know how much torque to put on the hozzel. You won't notice it. make it a "digger" per say? But i am talking more along the lines of the bounce, leading edge, etc. Usually weak, but occasionally strong, and if done intelligently where you don't hurt the clubs playability it's no big deal. i dont need that. ***GIVEAWAY*** Cleveland CBX ZipCore Wedge! Where Can You Get Your Lie Angle Adjusted, Should You Use Heavier Shafts in Wedges? I am now thinking I am just going to bend my 712 Ap2 irons to the 714 AP2 specs so my gaps will match up better with my wedges. Albion, MI 49224 Yes, it would make the clubs a little 'longer' (with a lower ball flight), but it might not be worth it, especially if you already take a divot. Ultimately, your answer is yes, you can do this. What I havent seen mentioned is that iron shafts have changed a great deal and offer more low kick (higher launch/spin) options to be able to match with those lofts. So you bend them 1 degree strong, bounce follows it by a degree. Will the clubs dig more or enough to tell a difference? If you can get it in the air, no problem. traditional lofts ftw (let the technology be what determines added length/distance, not loft changes). Great point I am a low ball hitter looking for more distance especially in my high irons. NOW AVAILABLE: GolfWRX G/Fore Hats and Holderness & Bourne Polos! Novak has made five cuts from seven starts since qualifying, with the most significant results being 17th in Bermuda (another wind-affected coastal course) 12th at the much higher-grade Sony Open and 29th at last weeks Honda Classic. I just switched from Wilson Ci9 to Taylormade TP MC, and Ive gained almost 15 yards despite the lofts being higher. Cleveland RTX4 50, 54, 58 I was fit for my current irons and they were bent 2 degrees strong for ball flight purposes. If you've got 2* upright and don't need that configuration, the heel will dig in and you'd pull the shots left (right handed). Potentially, this would mean the toe digs in and your shots go right (right handed). Secondly, it also takes absolutely no athletic ability to learn how to set up in the proper posture to make a sound golf swing possible. I tried it today but I can still hit my 6i farther than my 64 degree lw. This also gives me room for more wedges. What bounce does is keep the leading edge from digging into the ground. Cleveland RTX4 50, 54, 58 Plenty have broken their duck here, and now the Puerto Rico curse has been resigned to history lets get with a couple of players who have their best days in front of them. Pasted as rich text. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Why knowing the different variations in epoxy matter Here How to create excitement before they take the first What you can expect with a Mitchell Golf Angle Mitchell Golf Equipment Company 759 Decided to get lofts and lie's double checked on my irons for peace of mind and following a gap check session get them bent 2 degree strong to the original manufacturer loft spec. Below, you'll see the results. Hoofer, Ecco, Bushnell Another reason why stronger lofts dont always mean more distance is something I do frequently to help golfers hit the ball farther weaken lofts. Lower lofts will travel a bit farther and a bit lower, higher lofts will travel a bit less and fly a bit higher. Location. Balls: Chrome Soft, Kirkland Signature 3pc, Srixon Q Star Tour, Grip preference: various GripMaster leather options. So to get the most performance out of each iron, for these low ball hitters, we need to add loft. Ball- Bridgestone Tour B X, In the grand scheme of things, I would say zero effect. If the club has an abundance of bounce and/or a rounded leading edge, reducing bounce by 2* might not matter. Golfers can see their spin rate drop thousands of RPMs from the rough (depending on the rough and type of lie), so being able to keep their shots in the air with enough spin to stop the ball on the green can be a huge part of helping them shoot lower scores. Upload or insert images from URL. Forged irons should be checked every year or 2 anyway for loft/lie. It's a club you pick off the turf anyway. If you think about it, a flatter lie would be toe down for your swing. He hasnt let that chance go, and while the opening nine events certainly havent been stunning seven missed cuts he showed up at Bermuda, finishing 35th after entering Sunday inside the top-15. See below the make percentage for an average golfer from varying distances. One good example comes to mind. The trajectory, depending on your swing, should be flatter. Just curious but, can I bend a set of titleist cb718 to the titleist ap2 718 specs? ENTER NOW! Yes, the T200 can be bent 2 degrees flat and beyond 2 degrees upright Titleist manufactures heads 2 degrees upright which can be bent up to a further 2 degrees i.e up to 4 degrees from standard Please sign in to comment TUser January 21, 2020 at 08:09 AM Along the same lines, I got my new T200 irons late last year. Each one of those sees him rightly disputing the market number one, but Im not sure I can get involved at around 20-25-to-one with any of the favourites, even if they hold excellent claims. You cannot paste images directly. But if it'll mess up the performance or whatnot, I'm not messing with it. The question is, again, Do you really want to get better at golf?. So if you have the time, watch this cool video that I really like explaining how important lie angle is for your golf game: Having and knowing the correct lie angle of your clubs will be a game changer, I promise! I do not find these to dig at all. A 4 iron only has 1 degree of bounce standard so will I have negative bounce when bent two degrees strong? Titleist 818 H1 19 HybridMiura CB-57 4-PW It is a lot easier to find what lie angle you need in your golf clubs and purchase a set rather than have to individually bend each club. As you watch PGA or LPGA golf, you will see very little personalization to this basic fundamental. By Sitemap. Well this article outlines a variety of statistics which will help you pinpoint which areas of the game you are above or below average. TM Spider Mallet w/ Carbon insert I know that for every degree strong I bend it, it will take a degree off the bounce. And its one of only two elements of the golf swing that require absolutely no physical skills. Ping G410 3, 5 and 7 wood, Ping G410 5 hybrid-not much use. There is no worry about bending a club that was bent last year or last week. Titleist Response to USGA / R&A Distance Insights, Bending 716MB irons 1 or 2 degrees strong. OK, quick question. What to consider when bending golf clubs. Ping G425 5 wood & hybrid Youll be amazed at the difference a properly fit set of irons can make to your game. This is even less a personal thing than the grip with very little variation, there is a single way to set up to a golf ball to help a good golf swing happen. On the short end, as the pitching wedge loft gets stronger you end up with wider gaps in the scoring clubs. December 27, 2014 in Club Making/Repair & DIY Projects. Uneven lies can vary more than an inch, and based on club geometry that is 1.6* right there, and I can't say I had much effect on the playability of the club. Golfers change the lie angle of a club to better their chances of hitting the center of the clubface. All rights reserved. I couldn't agree more, they are a thing of beauty but also of art, it'll change the effect the way the club goes through the turf, I've lost some distance using these because I was hitting the new T-MB which 3 iron went a mile, but the 3 iron in the MB's is what dreams are made of, way easy to hit and launch, I wouldn't want to mess with it, that being said I did increase the lie up 2 degrees for my swing:). This will reduce any penalty shots and subsequently the number of doubles-or-worse in your round. Display as a link instead, TaylorMade Aero Burner TP 15 / Matrix White Tie 70-X In 11 starts since gaining his place at the top level, the 26-year-old has made four cuts, including a first-time-out 12th at the Fortinet, 10th in Bermuda (led after a first round 62), 22nd at the American Express 7th after day one) and top-30 at the Plantation Course last week. But bending an iron weak is not as well understood by many golfers, so they are more hesitant. It flies lower and that is about it. Some get more spin, some less. If you bend lie, you will effect swingweight. i realize the distance and ball flight. And provided the hosel of the wood is long enough to allow the bending bar to fit over its length, metal woods can be bent to custom-fit a player. Custom Edel E-3 Putter, More than likely you will hit the ball a bit farther as well, potentially close to 1/2 a club. I even fitted a customer with a new SLDR and put him in a 12 degree head with a TP shaft. Loft is used to get the irons back to the proper launch window. Great answer Blake. Chamblee takes on Tiger: Brandel, meet Bayless, Tweets of the week: Lizards, grammar police, bad greens, worse sunglasses. Furthermore, he was 15th at the end of the first round on debut here last year and 11th after Thursdays round at the correlative Corales in the Dominican Republic. How will that affect it though? Sounds like it's a long iron. We dive into a subject we get A LOT of questions about, bending your clubs properly. So, I am now waiting for a major brand to market and advertise that their new, weaker lofts will add distance for most golfers. How accurate are the loft and lie readings of clubs straight from the manufacturer? Taylor Made tour issue M2 T3 Ozik Matrix 8M3 X Guess I dont get it. with more loft than its designed for, so he cant go wrong by bending heads stronger. Vokey 54.10, 2009 58.12 M, Testing TM MG2 60* TW grind and MG356* TW grind. I dont like alot of offset so that changes things a little. SW: 56* Scratch Tour Dept(CC grooves) w/ Dynamic Gold SpinnerLW: 60* Scratch Tour Department (CC grooves) w/ Dynamic Gold SpinnerXW: 64* Cally XForged Vintage w/ DG X100 8 iron tiger steppedPutter: Nike Method Prototype 006 at 34"Have a ton of back-ups in all categories, but there are always 14 clubs in the bag that differ depending on the course and set-up. A standard golf shop, or fitting center will be able to do this. Sure. Couldn't agree more with your entire post. Like most things in life, the real answer is it all depends, golf is probably the only sport where they use generalization to describe something that is quite complicated. Using like say an Older Macgregor blade butter knife with a thin sharp leading edge on the sole if you deloft more than 1 degree or so you have a chance of digging to China. on tight fairways. Compare that with 49-year-old Atwal, with a best of 49th place since 2021 and an average first-round placing of around 120th for his three starts in 2023, and Scott Brown, admittedly a former winner here, but now 719th in the world and who has, since September, withdrawn twice during tournaments, and missed his last two cuts (Pebble and Honda) ranking 99th and 136th for his first round he certainly looks wrong in every way. Reset Password We also see these players having gapping issues with a mid iron, not just 4 and 5 like your example, so adding loft achieves better gapping as well. You can post now and register later. However, in reality it was now a 63* wedge so what happened. So if you are steep or tend to take a pretty good divot, you may not want to bend them more than a degree. The drop off in make percentage from 3-6 feet and 6-9 feet is huge. Justin Rose posts mysterious custom JR irons on Instagram. Adams A12 19 - Fuji HB 80X, PXG 0311X 4 - HZRDUS Red 105 X So I hit my standard 50 yard pitch with a 54* wedge. I think that makes a difference. 1 is somewhere between somewhat important to very important, then the next question has to be.
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